Name: The Line Between Discipline and Addiction
Uploaded: 2021-09-16T17:12:38.000Z
Description: Watch the stand-up comedy video 'The Line Between Discipline and Addiction' from PowerfulJRE on Comedy Buff. Published 2021-09-16. Transcript available.

Watch the stand-up comedy video 'The Line Between Discipline and Addiction' from PowerfulJRE on Comedy Buff. Published 2021-09-16. Transcript available.

the Joe Rogan experience. But the diagnosis of addiction is really based on
behaviors and can be briefly summarized as the four C's: control, compulsion,
craving, and consequences, especially continued use despite consequences. So
like what if you're, like I have friends that are addicted to golf and they
just
can't wait to go play golf. What's the consequences? Well it might be that
their
spouse says, "Gee-whiz, why are you playing golf all the time?" Maybe they just
need a new
spouse. Well, okay. Okay, so this actually comes up a lot in clinical care.
Like to
what extent is it my problem and to what extent do I have to change my life?
And
I always say to patients, you know, that is a great question and not one that I
can
answer for you, but maybe together we can find the answer. Because the truth is
sometimes it is a question of needing to change your life, right? And I wouldn't
presume to necessarily know, especially with cases on the border. Now there are
certainly-- On the border. I mean on the border of like-- Consequence. Pathological,
yeah. I mean there
are some cases where like, okay, you don't need to be a psychiatrist to
diagnose that
this person has addiction. It seems open to interpretation in the world of what
you
would call extreme winners, like the Michael Jordans of the world, the people
that
are just absolutely completely obsessed with winning. That seems like you could
kind of call that an addiction, but then they are the most celebrated people in
all
of the world. Right. So you're tapping into something that is really important
to
talk about, which is that our society rewards certain types of addictions and
not
others. We certainly reward professional athletes who have become obsessively
focused
on their sport. We certainly reward workaholics of all types. And again, it's
not to say that we
we should pathologize all types of intensity or all types of commitment to a
behavior. That's not what it's about. But what I think is important is to
recognize that the same mental machinery
that approach and avoid behavior mediated by dopamine that is at play when we
become addicted to something can be at play really in all different aspects of
our lives, not just drugs and alcohol.
So you're essentially looking at this very objectively. You're not making a
judgment call. You're just saying the same mechanism is in place, whether it is
extremely beneficial, like you are, Michael Jordan, or whether extremely
detrimental,
like you're a person is addicted to crack, or you're a gambling addict who
keeps blowing all their family's money. It's kind of you're on the same human
neurological pathway.
That's exactly right. It's the same mental machinery that's, you know, being
applied. And again, there are certain types of addictive behaviors that our
society rewards. But even in those cases, I think it's important for people to
really closely evaluate,
evaluate potential hidden consequences. And I feel like that's happening. I
mean, just using the example, again, of athletes, I feel like there are more
and more and more there are athletes who are in different ways kind of
questioning their lifestyle or the things that they have to do.
You know, you know, you know, which I think is good. I think it's always good
to look at the pros and cons. Basically, there's no there's never the light
without the dark. You know, it's really that dialectic that comes into play,
really, in all aspects of our lives, which I think we need to talk about and
and think about.
We we we celebrate the people that are absolutely completely obsessed with
performance and they have everything dialed in, including their calories, their
macronutrients, the amount of sleep they have, the amount of recovery that they
seek out, how they do it.
But they have a massive reward for that, right? The massive reward is the glory
of being a Michael Jordan or being a Mike Tyson or being a Sugar Ray Leonard or
whoever it is at the peak of their performance when they're on top of the world.
There's a great deal of benefit to having what many would just call extreme
discipline.
Mm hmm. Yes. So what's wrong with that?
Well, what we hear very little about is when that road comes to an end and that
escalating glory and reward dries up and what those people's lives are like
after that.
And my sense is that unless they've worked very hard to cultivate other aspects
of their personality, when that dopamine trail dries up because they get
injured or they just age.
Yeah. Then they have to contend with, you know, the come down, you know, the
dopamine deficit state, not to mention all of the other aspects related to loss
of identity.
You know, who am I if I'm not this person who's winning and of course, that's
an old trope.
I mean, we know that, but we don't we don't hear about those those athletes
after that.
The other thing I would say that that, you know, that you point out in that
description, which I think is also key to the process of becoming addicted, is
the ways in which addiction is also about controlling and changing the way we
feel in the moment.
Rather than tolerating the feelings or the uncertainty of what's next and just
letting it wash over us.
So a really key important aspect of what you call discipline, but which I think
in some contexts might be addiction, is wanting to control what we're feeling,
you know, when we feel it.
And I think this is also deeply embedded into modern life and modern culture.
Explain that, wanting to control what we're feeling and when we feel it.
Yeah.
And that's what separates discipline from addiction.
No, I think I think those are there's overlap there.
So let me let me go back.
So part of part of what drives the phenomenon of addiction is that people
control what they feel when they feel it.
So, for example, you know, in this moment, let's say I'm struggling.
Right.
But I feel like, oh, I can get through this because when this is over, I'm not
saying I'm struggling, but I mean, if I were.
I know what you're saying.
Yeah.
But because when this is over, I'm going to reward myself with X, Y and Z.
So like if you go running and then afterwards, you can have a slice of pizza.
That's right.
Exactly.
So it's the way that we bracket our endeavors with rewards.
And this is just like deeply embedded into our culture.
And the control aspect is a big part of the addictive aspect, because I'm now
going to control the way I feel when I feel it,
which is a very different way of living if you were to eliminate rewards as a
way to shape time.
If you were to think, I'm not going to do anything to reward myself today.
I'm just going to get through the day.
It totally changes the arc of of our experience in the moment.
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