Name: Joe Rogan Experience #1792 - Daryl Davis & Bill Ottman
Uploaded: 2022-03-15T00:00:00.000Z
Description: Watch the stand-up comedy video 'Joe Rogan Experience #1792 - Daryl Davis & Bill Ottman' from PowerfulJRE on Comedy Buff. Published 2022-03-15. Transcript available.

Watch the stand-up comedy video 'Joe Rogan Experience #1792 - Daryl Davis & Bill Ottman' from PowerfulJRE on Comedy Buff. Published 2022-03-15. Transcript available.

Joe Rogan Experience #1792 - Daryl Davis & Bill Ottman

Joe Rogan podcast check it out the Joe Rogan experience trained by day Joe Rogan
podcast by
night all day and we're up gentlemen what's happening good to see you you're
happening man
good to see you again thank you for having me beautiful purple shirt I love it
thanks for
having us and thank you and Bill tell first of all tell me what's going on with
minds minds is
one of the first that I was aware of like alternative social media networks
that was
committed to free speech yeah what how's it going it's going I mean there's
sort of a whole landscape
of alternative networks emerging and so you've got this spectrum of apps where
you've like I think
of I put everything through a litmus test when I'm thinking of an alternative
network basically is it
transparent does it publish their source code most of these alternative apps I
don't need to name
names but I could they're they don't publish their source code so you can't
look at the algorithms
to see what's happening you can't see if there's spyware in there if they have
google analytics
little nasty right stuff that so you're talking about getter getter yeah
because I found out the
parlor rumble now and now I'm not trying to trash these people I think that the
free speech stuff is
good like the more but some of their terms aren't even free speech so you know
free speech policy is
essential so I absolutely respect any network that is putting forward a free
speech policy but if you
can't have free speech policy with sketchy algorithms and closed source code
because then we don't know if
you're soft uh censoring shadow banning we don't know what's happening in the
news feed behind the scenes
which we definitely know Facebook does Instagram does Twitter does that's all
real right so then you've
got are they privacy focused and to end encrypted do they have access to the
content of your messages
like so we use a n10 encrypted messenger protocol called matrix so that we don't
even have access to
people's conversations like I don't want access right and then you've also got
you know do they pay creators
fairly so you've got these check marks that you go through with each but open
source is key the future
there is nothing without open source any app if they're claiming to be an
alternative and they're
not open source they're not in the same conversation it's a completely
different animal and they should
not be taken seriously because they're not being transparent with the world so
and then you get into
decentralization and actually building an app that so Google says don't be evil
but it's really can't be evil
make it we want to make it impossible for us to even take down our network at
all and that's why the like
immutable distributed systems like blockchains and you know Tor and all of the
IPFS all of these
different decentralized systems are emerging and we're in we're interacting
with them we're not fully
decentralized yet so but that's there's like a progression that a lot of apps
in the web 3 slash
decentralized web space are moving towards so okay and and so Daryl to fill
people in on you you've been
on the podcast before and you have an incredible history you're a brilliant
musician and you have
personally converted what's the number now it's more than 200 Ku Klux Klan
members neo-nazis I mean we
talked about these guys giving you their their Klan outfits and retiring
because they met you and just
because you had reasonable conversations with them made them realize how stupid
these ideologies that
they had somehow or another been captivated by I mean at the end of the day you
know a missed
opportunity for dialogue is a missed opportunity for conflict resolution it's
as simple as that but
it's not just having a dialogue or a conversation or debate it's the way that
we have it how we
communicate you know that makes it effective like for example you know I've
been to 61 countries on six
continents I've played in all 50 states so all that is to say that I've been
exposed to a multitude of skin
colors ethnicities religions cultures ideologies etc and all of that has shaped
who I've become now all that
travel does not make me a better human being than somebody else it just gives
me a better perspective of mass
humanity and what I've learned is that no matter how far I've gone from our own
country right next door to
Canada or Mexico or halfway around the globe no matter how different the people
I encounter may be they
don't look like me they don't speak my language they don't worship as I do or
whatever I always conclude at
the end of the day that we all are human beings and as such we all want these
same five core values in
our lives everybody wants to be loved everybody wants to be respected everybody
wants to be heard we all
want to be treated fairly and we all basically want the same things for our
family as anybody else wants
for their family and if we learn to apply those five core values when we find
ourselves in an adversarial
situation or a culture or society in which we're unfamiliar I can guarantee
that the navigation will
be a lot more smoother and essentially that's what's happening here at mines we're
allowing people
to be heard we're showing them that kind of respect we don't have to respect
what they're saying but
respect their right to say it and we provide that platform because you know
when you when you don't do
that you're driving people to a platform that will embrace them and then it
becomes an echo chamber
and essentially it could become a breeding ground for a cesspool of nefarious
activities whether it's
extremism or violence or conspiracy theories or what have you so it seems like
there's an issue with many
social media companies where they want to censor bad ideas and it seems to me
that part of that is
because the work involved in taking a person who's a neo-nazi or ku klux klan
member and showing them
the error of their ways allowing them to spread their nonsense and then slowly
but surely introducing
them to better ideas it's exhausting and we're not willing to do the work right
exactly so what twitter
does is like fuck you get out of here what instagram does the same thing with
all these people but the
problem with that is then it goes further and further and further and further
down where you're getting
rid of people for just not agreeing with you
so this is empirical now so so darrell and i just wrote this paper called the
censorship effect along
with jesse morton um uh justin lane ron schultz and uh my brother jack and the
multiple phds like
serious research has gone into this even the left out of outlets like vox are
now admitting that deep
platforming causes more severe radicalization this is being admitted across the
board so the fact that big
tech apps are not looking at this data and applying it to their policy it makes
it makes you almost have
to speculate that they're intentionally causing it i mean because they these
are very smart people that
work at big tech sites they know about data science they know the spread of of
information i don't think
they're intentionally causing it i think they're first of all there's an
ideology that is attached to
all the big tech companies whether it's google or facebook or twitter you have
to be what they think is
woke right you have to you have to subscribe to a certain line of thinking and
anybody that deviates
from that line of thinking should be suppressed minimized or banned so how is
that not intentional
but it's not intentional meaning they don't they're not trying to radicalize
people that's not what
they're trying to do no but they i don't they're just foolish in their approach
i think some of their
data science researchers do know yeah but they're not getting to the people
that are the ceos now the ceos
have to virtue signal all the people that are executives have to virtue signal
and they have to
say we're doing our best to stop harmful talk and harm but but what they call
harmful like a lot of it is
like disagreeing with pharmaceutical companies which is just crazy like these
are the lyingest liars that
ever lied did you see zuck on lex's show yes i did what did you think what you
know it's hard it's hard
because like that guy has an enormous responsibility he has he's the the head
of this insanely huge platform
that covers the entire planet earth and everything he says has to be measured
it's like you ever see him
drink water he drinks water like this like a weird way of drinking water he
doesn't drink the water
he like sips it it touches his lips and then he's done he's like everything is
like measured measured
like i can't imagine trying to speak freely when you're the ceo of facebook i
think it's almost
like pointless to talk to him in that sort of circumstance well you know to to
your point
about you know people doing this and and defending it and so forth and so on i
mean i think the quote
by upton sinclair comes into play i think he said something to the effect of it's
difficult for for a man
to understand something when his salary depends upon him not understanding it
yes yes yeah and if you
live in that world if you live in that tech world and i have many friends who
have you know they're
executives at these places that is just the fucking doctrine you have to like
you have so many employees
that they have these like radical ideas about what you're supposed to do and
not supposed to do and
what you're supposed to platform and not platform and this idea of platforming
people you know like
i have people on this podcast all the time that i don't agree with at all and i
have them on or i
agree with them very little and i want to see what's going on in their head and
i'll get that like
you're platforming these people you're platforming a bad person like i don't
think they're bad people
i just don't agree with them and they have a right-wing ideology that i don't
think should be
suppressed i think you should try to pick it apart you cannot change someone's
mind if you do not platform them it is impossible for someone with horrible
ideology yes to change
and it's about i should say not just a right-wing idea there's there's a lot of
people with left-wing
ideologies that i think are ridiculous and i want to pick those apart too i
want to have conversations
with people and this idea that you're only supposed to have conversations with
people that you absolutely
agree with and that what you're doing is just broadcasting these ideas to
better humanity like
if you want a better humanity have conversations with people hey look you know
this goes all the
way back i mean centuries even even back to bc as in before christ right i mean
let's look we can go
back as far let's just say copernicus the astronomer who passed away in 1543
okay he's up until then
the belief was that we are a geocentric model universe disinfo huh sorry no i
was saying that
it would have been called disinfo okay yeah exactly so uh even the catholic
church endorsed that we are a
geocentric uh model universe meaning that the earth is the center of the
universe and everything revolves
around us right and copernicus said no we're just another planet the sun is the
center of the universe
and everything revolves around the sun which makes it a heliocentric uh model
and uh everybody scorned
him ridiculed him a hundred years later uh galileo came along and built upon
copernicus's theory and
developed it even further and said yes you know we we are a heliocentric uh
model and he got he got arrested
arrested for heresy against the catholic church all right but guess what he was
right he was right
so you know sometimes you know we have to stand up to the masses not just join
in because everybody else
thinks this way and it's also the problem of the walled garden right there's a
lot of people that are
that get booted from these social media platforms whether it's twitter or
facebook and then they look
at that and they look at those people with further and further disdain and it
separates t